EdTechTalk#83 - Curtis Bonk, The World is Open
September 21, 2009
A Discussion with Curtis Bonk
author of The World is Open
Chat Log Below
19:49:18 PeggyG -> awesome audio now!!
19:49:32 kcaise -> oh no, 2 dave c's?
19:49:43 sendkathy -> wow!
19:50:18 stlouisohio -> they were interested because they didnt see how what they were doing was actually hindering the students from the way that they want to learn
19:51:25 cjbonk -> Hello Curt
19:51:28 kcaise -> welcome curt!
19:51:30 DaveC -> Hello Curt
19:51:31 PeggyG -> Welcome Curt!!
19:51:31 Alvin Trusty -> Hi Curt
19:51:32 stlouisohio -> Hello
19:51:33 onepercentyellow -> hi
19:51:37 Gary -> Hellow
19:51:45 Samantha Camisi -> Hi!
19:51:46 sendkathy -> Hey Curt, my daughter is a freshman at IU!
19:51:46 matt montagne -> hello from Palo Alto, CA Curt!!!
19:52:01 csitterley -> Hi Curt
19:52:06 demacisaac -> :D
19:52:06 jackiegerstein -> Hi Curt!
19:52:13 plnaugle -> Hi Curt.
19:52:13 cjbonk -> In what area...?
19:52:16 hshawjr -> Hi Curt
19:52:20 cjbonk -> Hey
19:52:23 PeggyG -> http://worldisopen.com
19:52:33 sendkathy -> haha
19:52:57 sendkathy -> she like anthropology and journalism
19:53:26 PeggyG -> http://php.indiana.edu/~cjbonk/ Curt Bonk's e-Learning World
19:54:34 plnaugle -> I don't hear anything anymore.
19:54:46 PeggyG -> still streaming Paula
19:54:59 plnaugle -> I got it bsck.
19:55:41 BigMouthDurff -> everyone twitter
19:55:44 matt montagne -> Love Curt's bobble head!
19:56:58 PeggyG -> that bobblehead is great! makes you just want to sit and smile :-)
19:57:21 BigMouthDurff -> can we swell our #s to 100 ?
19:58:16 kcaise -> yes
19:58:26 kcaise -> with vicki and julie lindsay
19:58:32 kcaise -> vicki davis
19:58:42 BigMouthDurff -> cool
19:58:48 jackiegerstein -> Yes
19:58:51 PeggyG -> Curt's book is available on Amazon for Kindle :-) You can have it in your hands in less than 3 minutes if you have a Kindle!
19:59:03 kcaise -> or on the itouch
19:59:24 plnaugle -> Thanks Peggy I'll order it for the Kindle on my iPhone.
19:59:30 matt montagne -> @Peggy - nice to see it available in Kindle format...I'm actually surprised that many "New Learning/Web 2.0ey" types of books aren't
19:59:30 cjbonk -> Yes, on the Kindle
20:00:01 PeggyG -> I'm starting to find more of them available on Kindle now
20:00:25 PeggyG -> I love that Kindle books can also be read on my iPhone! nice feature!
20:00:38 cjbonk -> Glad you like the bubblehead Matt! That is from Taiwan.
20:01:27 nancykeane -> Hi Audrey!
20:01:32 matt montagne -> Software engineers have collaboration wired into their DNA I think
20:02:19 matt montagne -> Sharing code across the web was one of the earliest uses of the Internet
20:02:52 BigMouthDurff -> hi kathy
20:02:57 sendkathy -> hey lisa
20:03:14 Audrey -> Hi Nancy!
20:03:15 sendkathy -> Tonight you are the BMD
20:03:30 BigMouthDurff -> that' me!
20:03:46 PeggyG -> I love the concept of "this is not your parent's education" :-)
20:03:51 matt montagne -> How did education get so darn expensive???
20:04:04 matt montagne -> How did Reed college in Oregon end up at 50 K annually??
20:04:25 kcaise -> oh my matt! 50K?
20:04:32 Rose -> Any sound yet?
20:04:45 BigMouthDurff -> yes
20:04:49 PeggyG -> yes Rose-click on play on the ustream or ETT-A
20:04:50 JohnS -> @Rose yes. You should be able to listen to the ustream.
20:04:52 matt montagne -> Yep, who can afford 50K??? That is evidence that something is out of alignment
20:04:53 JohnS -> Or on ETT-A
20:04:56 kcaise -> click on the play button rose on the ustream window
20:05:04 BigMouthDurff -> click the arrow in the ustrea
20:05:13 matt montagne -> at 50K, only the wealthy can get an education
20:05:14 BigMouthDurff -> ustream to your right
20:05:17 nancykeane -> My first house wasn't 50K
20:05:27 Rose -> Thanks, Peggy. Got ot!
20:05:34 Rose -> Got it!
20:05:43 PeggyG -> great Rose!
20:06:21 plnaugle -> I love the free education I'm getting through all the tweets from my PLN.
20:06:49 BigMouthDurff -> hi Jonas
20:06:55 BigMouthDurff -> hi 1%
20:06:59 plnaugle -> Free is great.
20:07:00 BigMouthDurff -> hi cyndid
20:07:06 BigMouthDurff -> hi ransom
20:07:10 JL -> Love the CLiff notes http://travelinedman.blogspot.com/2009/08/20-quick-points-from-world-is-...
20:07:30 cyndidannerkuhn -> Hye Durff, what's the deal Big Mouth Durff? lol
20:07:32 BigMouthDurff -> if everyone here twittered just once.....
20:08:12 BigMouthDurff -> cyndi - I was rather opinionated loudly earlier
20:08:15 plnaugle -> @durff I did Twitter it.
20:08:20 BigMouthDurff -> ty
20:08:21 cyndidannerkuhn -> I came late, Book Name?
20:08:35 JL -> http://worldisopen.com
20:08:36 DaveChamberlain -> @Cindy: The World Is Open
20:08:49 matt montagne -> or, even the non-for profit people
20:09:13 hshawjr -> gotta remember to not open up new page in this tab bounces me right out :)
20:09:23 cyndidannerkuhn -> thanks
20:09:54 Jon K. -> sort of a loss-leader to get them into the institution
20:10:28 jackiegerstein -> Higher Ed. will be so different 5 to 10 years from now.
20:10:31 matt montagne -> what about on the high end of the scale...will colleges that charge 50K plus survive??
20:11:03 PeggyG -> another big payoff population are those folks who have lost their jobs and need to find new career ventures requiring education
20:11:19 cyndidannerkuhn -> gona have to change culture of HIgher Ed, the wheels of change move slowly at that level
20:11:34 JohnS -> The World is Open for a Reason: http://elearnmag.org/subpage.cfm?section=articles&article=85-1
20:11:53 jackiegerstein -> It will be the users - the students - who end up changing higher ed.
20:12:12 cjbonk -> Harnessing America’s Wasted Talent: New Dimensions for Higher Education, by Peter Smith, Jossey-Bass.
20:12:16 Samantha Camisi -> Jackie, that is true, what they demand, schools will provide.
20:12:24 stlouisohio -> higher ed is very slow to change
20:12:37 cyndidannerkuhn -> slow is an understatement!!
20:12:49 BigMouthDurff -> hi ChrisJ
20:12:56 BigMouthDurff -> hi alice
20:13:10 cyndidannerkuhn -> I teach in Higher Ed and it makes me crazy!! I am alwasy on the hot seat over it
20:13:13 alicebarr -> Hi Durff! Big Mouth?
20:13:36 stlouisohio -> i understand first hand by being in that demographic now, and they don't understand what is going on outside the university
20:13:37 jackiegerstein -> I teach for Kaplan - it is still a traditional school
20:14:05 cyndidannerkuhn -> Nope they don't, I am their, but I don't fit the mold of Higher Ed at all
20:14:10 hshawjr -> Sort of like Regents/Excelsior which allows DANTES test out for most of its degree work
20:14:54 stlouisohio -> having to petition to take a masters level class, to work on my tech endorsement while still an undergrad. getting into the class and we are working on powerpoint is a huge disappointment
20:15:01 jackiegerstein -> http://www.uopeople.org/
20:15:04 PeggyG -> they are very expensive courses for some very traditional learning in spite of being online
20:15:15 BigMouthDurff -> hi mike
20:15:25 BigMouthDurff -> there's alec
20:15:35 courosa -> hmmmm, there should actually be an open source Kool Aid.
20:15:45 BigMouthDurff -> and Jay?
20:15:49 cyndidannerkuhn -> I put my entire course on my website and many colleagues about had a heart attack
20:16:18 kcaise -> why @cyndidannerkuhn? why did they freak out?
20:16:18 cyndidannerkuhn -> giving it away, holy moly!! One said somebody might use it, DAH, that is the point!!
20:16:28 BigMouthDurff -> heart attacks? then your uni is hiring?
20:16:56 PeggyG -> economics are forcing universities to be more willing to think about open source opportunities--people can't afford to go to college!
20:17:01 BigMouthDurff -> I post everything too in K 12
20:17:04 courosa -> shhhhh ... don't let my institution know that I offer open courses.
20:17:12 matt montagne -> it is tought for the incumbent model to change without cannabilizing
20:17:13 demacisaac -> a friend of mine said "technology is not revolutionizing education" She said there is not enough evidence. I was hurt
20:17:14 stlouisohio -> yes i can see the heart attack coming when someone wants their content to be easy to access, and availible in student preferred form
20:17:29 BigMouthDurff -> Twitter it everyone - shout it from the roof tops
20:17:40 ransomtech -> @courosa - I won't tell...
20:17:50 BigMouthDurff -> I will
20:17:52 PeggyG -> @demacisaac--your colleague needs to read Curt's book :-)
20:17:58 BigMouthDurff -> oh wait, i did
20:18:10 BigMouthDurff -> hi monika
20:18:25 cyndidannerkuhn -> I'll include promo for Curts books i my next newsletter to COE faculty
20:18:39 demacisaac -> I know, she's not there,,,couldn't follow it. sigh feeling isolated
20:18:41 cjbonk -> Thanks Cyndi
20:18:55 monika -> hello
20:19:07 BigMouthDurff -> I annoy our staff with almost daily "Free PD" emails - many only read emails
20:19:10 sendkathy -> Curt, how do profs feel about shaping their courses in view of the fact that the course value seems out of purportion to the cost of taking the class?
20:19:18 BigMouthDurff -> hi cheeker
20:19:44 BigMouthDurff -> wb rose
20:19:49 stlouisohio -> one professor this week had to call the help desk because his projection screen was down, and the station said the projector was on. help desk comes over and rolls the screen back and explains that this is the only room on campus with a rear projection setup, professor then exclaims oh yes i had this issue last year in this room. then presents his powerpoint in bright green and blue gradiant which is impossible to see. let me say their were a lot of frustrated students
20:19:49 sendkathy -> proportion
20:19:55 BigMouthDurff -> need more food brb
20:19:58 Rose -> Yikes went to a link and got booted off...
20:20:22 PeggyG -> that makes so much sense about the audience!!
20:20:32 cyndidannerkuhn -> I would like to ban PowerPoint!!
20:20:32 sendkathy -> @stlouisohio, yikes, quality education
20:20:58 Alvin Trusty -> I would like everyone to learn to use PowerPoitn
20:21:00 stlouisohio -> best in the midwest
20:21:02 ChrisJohnston -> Keynote is good replacement or Prezi
20:21:07 JenW -> I still use PowerPoint -- I still teach powerpoint
20:21:07 nancykeane -> @cyndid -- Hear, hear. But I am told I have to teach it to college freshmen :-(
20:21:15 Jon K. -> PowerPoint can be done well, but is rarely done well
20:21:25 JenW -> actually -- I teach how to use Powerpoint......
20:21:27 cyndidannerkuhn -> They should know it by the time they are freshemnt in college
20:21:28 Alvin Trusty -> doing PPT well is more difficult
20:21:31 stlouisohio -> your freshman should already have a idea of powerpoint
20:21:32 sendkathy -> I let my 3rd graders use ppt cause it's offline and I know it will work
20:21:45 cyndidannerkuhn -> so many other grat options to Powerpoint, too man y just get stuck in it forever
20:21:58 BigMouthDurff -> hi plind
20:22:27 BigMouthDurff -> kathy we use stuff only online cause i can't download
20:22:32 JenW -> when something works -- I don't feel the great necessity to migrate from it....always learning something new
20:22:36 BigMouthDurff -> or i'm not supposed too
20:22:39 JenW -> in powerpoint
20:22:46 JohnS -> My kids learned ppt in first grade, but by fifth, they're still not any better at it than their teachers are :-(
20:23:25 stlouisohio -> most of the features you never use, but you should have a basic knowledge. create content and be able to share it
20:23:31 JenW -> kids are being taught the software -- not the options of using the software
20:23:33 BigMouthDurff -> first graders do podcasting here
20:23:39 sendkathy -> JohnS we'd need to teach graphic design, I have suggested the art teachers do this
20:23:51 JenW -> Hey Kathy
20:23:57 sendkathy -> Hey Jen!
20:24:03 stlouisohio -> art probably didnt take that to well
20:24:07 BigMouthDurff -> now wait i had 1 computer the first year
20:24:15 ChrisJohnston -> JohnS and BigMouthDurff where are you guys?
20:24:24 matt montagne -> but students who don't have access a broadband card for the semester/year
20:24:26 JohnS -> @kathy not necessarily graphic design, but a single session on visual literacy would go a long way.
20:24:29 matt montagne -> *buy
20:24:33 BigMouthDurff -> we used blogs, wikis, podcasts, breeze, elluminate
20:24:53 BigMouthDurff -> Chris - i'm mrsdurff
20:24:55 JenW -> but Lisa - we are not the norm of teachers using tech ---
20:25:02 plnaugle -> I teach my 4th graders PPT and I let them put in all the transition, colors, word art, sound etc. at first. Then I show them how to create quality PPTs. They have to be taught how to do it properly.
20:25:06 BigMouthDurff -> in Hagerstown MD
20:25:18 BigMouthDurff -> true Jen
20:25:35 BigMouthDurff -> but then again
20:25:40 Alvin Trusty -> @plnaugle you are teaching PPT much differently than most... keep it up
20:25:40 JenW -> and where we are now -- does become the norm -- where will we be then??
20:25:47 BigMouthDurff -> if a disabled woman can do it.....
20:25:47 JenW -> when THEY are where we are now
20:25:48 sendkathy -> @pinaugle That's basically what I do too cuz they like the bells and whistles at first.
20:25:48 cyndidannerkuhn -> It is like driving a car, we don't just give a kid the kyes we teach then HOW to drive the car and it takes lots of practice
20:25:49 stlouisohio -> we should be the norm
20:25:55 BigMouthDurff -> hi kitchen
20:25:59 jackiegerstein -> http://onewebday.org/
20:26:01 plnaugle -> www.freerice.com
20:26:31 Rose -> Thanks for the sites
20:26:34 JenW -> @stlouisohio -- I think we should have realized that 10 years ago......and brought others along.......but generally everyone wandered alone -- til about -- what 4 or 5 years ago?? then we started collaborating more
20:26:35 nancykeane -> www.freepoverty.com/
20:26:37 kitchenerd -> Hello
20:26:57 BigMouthDurff -> Rose - many like sites on delicious or diigo
20:27:20 plnaugle -> I have to laugh at their first couple of PPTs. I can hardly read the words because of the color choices and font selection, but they get better as the year goes along.
20:27:21 cyndidannerkuhn -> hate to ask but is all this stuff in the book, wow wish I had read before I got here
20:27:31 BigMouthDurff -> nancy - haven't seen that one = ty
20:27:43 Rose -> Wow...thanks. Do I just search in Diigo?
20:27:50 BigMouthDurff -> yup
20:27:50 nancykeane -> @durff Donates clean water
20:27:57 BigMouthDurff -> cool
20:27:58 ransomtech -> http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Main_Page
20:28:03 JenW -> @paula -- we made christmas card powerpoints -- all the bells and whistles -- kids had a grand time -- and yes, we had swiveling letters at times too
20:28:14 sendkathy -> lol
20:28:24 sendkathy -> kids just wanna have fun
20:28:32 BigMouthDurff -> :)
20:28:49 plnaugle -> LOL
20:28:53 matt montagne -> you could ask a variant of the same romeo/juliet question...would we have had William Shakespeare if he would've gone through the US educational system?
20:29:10 BigMouthDurff -> gee, then go out and find it
20:29:16 JenW -> is it an assumption that just because the opportunity is there that people will take advantage of the opportunity??
20:29:24 nancykeane -> What if Shakespeare was limited to 140 characters?
20:29:25 BigMouthDurff -> surf the streams of learning
20:29:47 BigMouthDurff -> nancy - he would be more concise
20:29:48 alicebarr -> What agreat assignment... What if Romeo and Juliet had cell phones.... Sending to English teacher now
20:29:58 stlouisohio -> as an undergrad student i have to find a way to change the process, bc i teach the teachers how to use this stuff. but then i take the classes in education dept and find that its the same. Ex we have a smartboard in front of the class, but in the profs own words we wont be using that because i'm not sure how it works. my response after class i could show you how to use that if you want.... and i'm the student. reminds that most of the time the students are the ones showing the teachers how to use the technology @kathy
20:30:07 stlouisohio -> @jen
20:30:14 stlouisohio -> sorry lost audio
20:30:14 Rose -> Jen, Only go getters are willing to take advantage and work to learn.
20:30:40 Rose -> Life long learners = go getters
20:30:45 BigMouthDurff -> stlouis i love it when a kid does that
20:30:55 cyndidannerkuhn -> Good for you Stloiusohio!!!
20:30:56 matt montagne -> Yale
20:31:00 BigMouthDurff -> i beg them to ask three before me
20:31:02 mike3 -> BYU
20:31:03 stlouisohio -> irna
20:31:04 Anne V -> China?
20:31:05 Samantha Camisi -> University of Maryland University College 1947?
20:31:06 stlouisohio -> iran
20:31:06 plnaugle -> Some people want to be spoon fed. Some are rsponsible for their own learning.
20:31:07 PeggyG -> Berkeley?
20:31:14 hshawjr -> Sanford
20:31:17 stlouisohio -> no idea
20:31:17 matt montagne -> Wisconsin- Madison :-)
20:31:19 jackiegerstein -> China
20:31:20 cyndidannerkuhn -> no clue
20:31:23 Jon K. -> Open University in UK?
20:31:24 BigMouthDurff -> eating
20:31:31 JenM -> @matt ... go BADGERS!
20:31:39 nancykeane -> Open University?
20:31:45 hshawjr -> USC
20:31:58 BigMouthDurff -> yale
20:32:02 jackiegerstein -> Dubai?
20:32:13 matt montagne -> Curt--I knew I liked you...I'm a UW-Madison graduate as well!!! On Wisconsin!
20:32:22 Anne V -> I remember "taking" a course on PBS with a workbook when I was in preschool... what was my mother thinking
20:32:37 PeggyG -> Wow~had no idea about Nat. Univ. of Vietnam!
20:32:38 BigMouthDurff -> new zealand
20:33:18 BigMouthDurff -> matt is cozing it up to the teacher again
20:33:31 JohnS -> That could be a really bad thing if those policies are misguided.
20:33:48 BigMouthDurff -> hi charlie
20:33:55 charlie -> hello all
20:34:02 matt montagne -> @Durff :-)
20:34:29 stlouisohio -> I must get going, working a shift at the hospital tonight and class after that. follow me on twitter if you'd like stlouisohio... its been great talking to you all. See you next week
20:34:47 BigMouthDurff -> bye!
20:35:07 plnaugle -> stlouisohio Have a good night.
20:35:17 PeggyG -> I love this section in his first chapter: I ustreamed your ustream: now that's a twitter of an idea! :-)
20:35:45 DaveChamberlain -> I would love to see digital books that were customized to the school, district or area, and the content could be reordered to match up with local holidays and other curricula
20:36:18 matt montagne -> Publishers probably have a really hard time imagining how they can make $$$ with a different model.
20:36:26 Audrey -> Great idea Dave. This would be a great opportunity for local teachers too to write and publish.
20:36:30 cyndidannerkuhn -> I think we have to think about textbooks differently!!
20:36:47 sendkathy -> @ Curt -What can professors/students do in the meatime?
20:36:54 matt montagne -> To me the e-format of the same textbook isn't interesting...it will get interesting when people make their own
20:37:12 cyndidannerkuhn -> I agtee Matt Montagne
20:37:15 JohnS -> And at K-12, we need the ebooks to be < 20% of the cost of print. Otherwise, it's going to cost way too much.
20:37:29 DaveChamberlain -> @Audrey, thanks :-)
20:37:33 plnaugle -> @matt I agree.
20:37:43 DaveChamberlain -> @Matt, yes!
20:37:59 charlie -> my high school spends 75 k a year on text books for 800 students over the course of four years we could easily by them each a laptop and a kindle
20:38:05 ransomtech -> I think that the whole paradigm of a book being used as main course resources is quickly chaning.
20:38:16 charlie -> but then i'd miss the nice dinners from the book reps
20:38:24 matt montagne -> @charlie OMG that is a great deal of $$$
20:38:27 JohnS -> @charlie yes, but if you bought book subscriptions, it would cost a lot more.
20:39:12 charlie -> we're going 1:1 and forcing the teachers to ditch being text dependent the text shouldn't drive the curriculum
20:39:16 courosa -> that is still an issue in my courses, not all students want to go open.
20:39:28 BigMouthDurff -> they'll learn
20:39:37 courosa -> the great majority do, but there are always a couple that are hesitant
20:39:42 JenW -> @charlie -- does the word "force" go over well??
20:39:42 JohnS -> that's the key. Economically, you can't replace print with e-books. You have to replace print with open content.
20:39:46 kcaise -> why do the students not want to go open @coursosa?
20:39:52 BigMouthDurff -> my kids are on the wild west of a web
20:40:08 matt montagne -> We spend an extraordinary amount of time in schools teaching kids how to organize analogue materials (note books, binders, backpacks, etc)....What if we spent a fraction of the time teaching students how to filter and organize digital information??
20:40:10 charlie -> "force" synonomous with "collaborate" no? ha ha
20:40:11 Audrey -> Even many higher students are nervous about going open with there work
20:40:11 cyndidannerkuhn -> I agree Druff, they will learn, sometimes you just have to force them, or puch them, once they figure it out, they love and and everything is better
20:40:19 courosa -> @kcaise they watch too much FOX News and think that predators are ready to pounce as soon as they hit post.
20:40:30 plnaugle -> So many educators don't want to be online and are afraid of having a digital footprint.
20:40:38 BigMouthDurff -> when they get to JenM's level, they will be ready for the Bonk's of the world
20:40:41 charlie -> @courosa i'm very scared of my fax machine. there is no filtering
20:40:45 charlie -> anything could come through
20:40:47 JenW -> @charlie -- hmmmm, I think a lot of teachers are feeling "forced" and that tends to have resistance -- agree??
20:40:51 jackiegerstein -> tan audience is a powerful motivator - kids are now wanting their content to go public.
20:40:58 ransomtech -> @courosa... some of my students feel the same way by simply opening their blogs up.
20:40:59 monika -> so we just need to educate on safety
20:41:04 BigMouthDurff -> faxmachines scare me! they make noises
20:41:14 alicebarr -> @matt That will be the shift, when teachers are info literate
20:41:16 charlie -> @ Jen I'd agree w that but honestly some just need to be forced or they will never change ...... the chalk jockies
20:41:17 kitchenerd -> our phones haven't been filtered...
20:41:32 JenW -> Hmmm -- I know some very effective chalk jockies
20:41:42 plnaugle -> The same ones who don't want to join a Ning or a wiki will post the Facebook.
20:41:45 courosa -> and, more critically, i find that a lot of teachers that do not want to go open, stay closed for two big reasons: 1) they break copyright to a huge extent, 2) their stuff is really not that good ... scared to put their stuff out in front of a critical audience.
20:42:00 monika -> :)
20:42:00 courosa -> not the only two reasons, but certainly two that we don't talk about a lot.
20:42:01 BigMouthDurff -> alec - they are scared
20:42:02 Samantha Camisi -> Some people feel shy abou their work. Maybe they would rather keep it between thethemselves and their teachers. Once it is out, it is out....
20:42:02 kitchenerd -> @courosa exactly right!
20:42:07 PeggyG -> I agree courosa!! that is my experience too!
20:42:17 Audrey -> Undergrads are selfconscious, they don't want to be wrong
20:42:43 kitchenerd -> teachers are fearful of posting work that might not be "perfect"
20:42:44 PeggyG -> @Audrey--I'm talking about the professors/instructors not the students :-)
20:42:53 plnaugle -> @courosa I agree. Someone asked on Twitter if we want to collaborate why do we close our classroom doors?
20:42:56 JenW -> @courosa I think the #1 is -- they don't know they can........
20:43:04 jackiegerstein -> Funny - I had the opposite effect when I connect a NING to a Blackboard course - My undergrads took to it better than I expected
20:43:07 JenM -> @alec ... yep ... same from students' perspective ... don't want to "prove" you don't know anything :)
20:43:11 BigMouthDurff -> @Audrey are they so different than the middle schoolers i have?
20:43:14 courosa -> @jenw yes, likely another strong reason.
20:43:20 monika -> that's what's missing though - teachers immersed personally in this
20:43:34 matt montagne -> http://www.ck12.org - nice open textbook project
20:43:35 charlie -> @ monika and administrators who aren't pushing for it...
20:43:38 Audrey -> @BigMouthDurff probably not....
20:43:46 courosa -> as i mentioned last week (although I don't know where I heard it), openness is the new validity.
20:43:48 JenW -> Most teachers -- honestly -- wonder if what they have to say is really worth listening to -- therefore why share.........I was one of those, were any of you??
20:43:48 Samantha Camisi -> Um, don't know what happened there with the typing, I think some students are shy. Posting is the electronic equivalent to asking a student to speak in front of the class.
20:43:59 plnaugle -> I know so few teachers in my district who have an online presence.
20:44:09 monika -> transparency is the new currency
20:44:12 charlie -> @ JenW i guess i've always been an arrogant ass so i like to share my work
20:44:23 JenM -> @chatroom: any questions for Curt in the chatroom??
20:44:25 jackiegerstein -> that is interesting monika
20:44:25 courosa -> @monika definitly
20:44:41 plnaugle -> @JenW I did a lot of lurking at the beginning. Learned how to share.
20:44:42 cyndidannerkuhn -> Teaching and learning is so much better when you share!!
20:44:45 JenW -> the 3 teachers at my school that do have an online presence are the 3 less likely people I would have guessed when I started working there....but they were open, listened to suggestions, sought guidance
20:44:50 BigMouthDurff -> @JenW I KNOW I'm not worth listening to, so I don't ask kids to either (well not often)
20:44:52 charlie -> @ Jen W but i think you're on to something with teachers being afraid to share that crasft knowledge
20:45:08 PeggyG -> many professors want the students to buy their books (those written by the prof) and require this for their courses!
20:45:17 hshawjr -> Independent learning is the only way many military perosnnel can work on their degree work. I was an early adopter and have only had one f2f college course over past 30 years.
20:45:30 BigMouthDurff -> me to Jen! the old first grade teacher is so into tech!!
20:45:32 JenW -> I think 8 years ago -- the "experts" of tech were 10 or 12...... now -- hmmmm, 1,000 or 1,200?? ;)
20:45:33 cyndidannerkuhn -> @PeggyG, that is absolutley correct!
20:45:37 sendkathy -> @Curt - Still wondering when/how college profs can be more effective now, why wait for all these major changes, how can profs provide a better education now?
20:45:39 courosa -> @JenM perhaps a question about moving beyond the existing hybrid models of institutions validating openness in its forms while standing tight with existing power models ... where are we headed?
20:45:39 charlie -> @ Peggy G i had a psych prof who did that. i pissed him off by checking the book out from the library and photocopying the whole thing for half the cost
20:45:47 BigMouthDurff -> she is ready to retire - chronologically
20:45:47 courosa -> or, what is possible.
20:45:49 charlie -> @ Peggy the look on his face was priceliess
20:45:59 demacisaac -> If we can't share,,,,My favorite lines in book are on page 33. "Technology by itself will [b]not[/b] empower learners. Innovative pedagogy is required" :) It makes me feel like there is hope even if we don't have working technology.
20:46:00 matt montagne -> will universities still be able to charge 50K annually in the future (or in 20 years, 100K plus annually???)
20:46:02 courosa -> @JenM I think he is headed that way already ...
20:46:07 JenW -> I also think that we give credibility to those -- accolades to those -- elevate some -- that might not be so worthy
20:46:07 PeggyG -> I'll bet!! probably turned you in for copyright violation :-)
20:46:15 jackiegerstein -> I think sharing is a "state of mind" - "a way of being" The "academics" who are sharing online were sharing their materials prior to social networking - just not so overt or public becasue the technology was not available
20:46:44 courosa -> @jackie I'd agree, mindset.
20:46:45 ChrisJohnston -> I am pursuing an undergrad degree online right now. Being married and with two kids it was the only way I could go back
20:47:12 cyndidannerkuhn -> I agree, sharing is a midnset!!
20:47:18 cyndidannerkuhn -> mmindset
20:47:21 PeggyG -> I wish the mindset of professors was changing more! They are still very proprietary about their content and copyright.
20:47:26 nancykeane -> I love wikipedia but my students are shocked when I suggest it!
20:47:28 JenW -> there needs to be a better way of hearing those who should be heard rather than just always listening to those who WANT to be heard
20:47:32 plind -> @chrisJ these technologies do make education available to many of us that otherwise would not have been able..
20:47:39 plnaugle -> @ChrisJohnston But you are pursuing it. I love that you are looking into education as a second career.
20:47:42 jackiegerstein -> Win-Win - is hard for many to grasp
20:47:43 PeggyG -> excellent point JenW!
20:47:52 monika -> how the heck do you listen and read all this
20:48:00 matt montagne -> damien bariexa comes to mind (a school psychologist who is very web saavy)
20:48:02 jackiegerstein -> LOl monika
20:48:15 courosa -> @monika oh, yo mean you don't have a small staff of reviewers that follow you around?
20:48:17 kitchenerd -> i'm reading, listening and working on reformatting a computer!
20:48:18 BigMouthDurff -> be like nike - just do it
20:48:19 Alvin Trusty -> put the lectures online now
20:48:23 sendkathy -> thanks Jeff
20:48:24 JenW -> @monika -- you skim ---
20:48:26 DaveChamberlain -> @monika, try formulating your next question at the same time :-)
20:48:28 PeggyG -> @monika-the good thing is this is being recorded so we can listen again and read the chat
20:48:29 JenW -> and color coding helps
20:48:35 BigMouthDurff -> run online
20:48:39 JenW -> first icon on the LEFT
20:48:41 BigMouthDurff -> teach online
20:48:45 BigMouthDurff -> live online
20:48:48 courosa -> YELLOW
20:48:52 monika -> thank you
20:48:52 BigMouthDurff -> online office hours
20:48:58 JenW -> @courosa LOL
20:49:00 BigMouthDurff -> collaborate online
20:49:02 JenW -> why didn't you choose WHITE
20:49:04 charlie -> online office hours? i like that idea
20:49:08 BigMouthDurff -> or be outdated
20:49:11 hshawjr -> @courosa yech
20:49:16 ChrisJohnston -> Tried to listen on Ustream on my iPhone (while feeding 1yr old) but it wasn't listed
20:49:17 BigMouthDurff -> and out of a job
20:49:17 plnaugle -> @courosa Can't see the yellow.
20:49:18 courosa -> White
20:49:28 JenW -> Sorry, Durff, I cannot agree 100% --- I don't agree everyone HAS to use tech
20:49:34 ransomtech -> 20 year dog-earred lecture notes... on transparencies in 3-ring binder. That's what teaching's all about!
20:49:34 JenW -> I can't agree to that
20:49:35 BigMouthDurff -> coursosa - be good
20:49:52 sendkathy -> My kids are not turned on by college ed, makes me sad, it seems just like when I went 30 years ago, same old same old, where is the accountability?
20:49:53 matt montagne -> skip the faculty and give the technology right to the kids
20:49:54 JenW -> @alec -- you made me Literally Laugh Out Loud
20:49:57 courosa -> Can anyone read this? Who has the secret decoder ring?
20:50:05 BigMouthDurff -> hi cbeard
20:50:08 JenW -> I have the RING Alec
20:50:12 cyndidannerkuhn -> My dean has be doing little presentations in all departments to show them, it is starting the conversationsm but wow, it is wearing me out!! but so exciting
20:50:14 charlie -> @ Jen W maybe the poeple who don't want to use tech should start their own school and see how many people enrol
20:50:21 courosa -> @jenw too funny
20:50:21 nancykeane -> @courosa -- My ring is working.
20:50:23 cbeard -> ::waving to BigMouth::
20:50:29 BigMouthDurff -> ya know courosa could be cursing us all in yellow.......
20:50:33 sendkathy -> @charlie- haha great idea
20:50:34 kitchenerd -> i agree curtis....message must come from the top
20:50:36 courosa -> @nancy ... too funny
20:50:38 demacisaac -> hmmm sounds like edtechtalk
20:50:39 JenW -> Charlie -- would you want your child to be taught the same way by all the teachers??
20:50:42 charlie -> or a worksheet and multiple choice school
20:50:54 JenW -> @courosa -- What do I win??
20:50:56 sendkathy -> baby steps- jen W
20:50:56 PeggyG -> you'll find most of Curt's excellent suggestions in his book!!! a must read!!
20:51:00 cyndidannerkuhn -> WE ABSOLUTELY cannot teach the way we were taught!
20:51:00 BigMouthDurff -> ransom woulf
20:51:01 plnaugle -> @Durff I think he is.
20:51:08 charlie -> @ Jen W no i wouldn't want them to be taught all the same way but i would want their teachers to be learners and model how to learn
20:51:12 courosa -> @JenW I already owe you a case of mugs
20:51:14 BigMouthDurff -> figures
20:51:21 BigMouthDurff -> not you Jen
20:51:23 monika -> i think if we got more teachers to take courses like alec's and cck09 - they would start making it personal
20:51:28 kitchenerd -> use youtube to begin research
20:51:31 BigMouthDurff -> i meant figures courosa is
20:51:34 monika -> teachers don't get to see how they are supposed to be teaching
20:51:36 JenW -> @charlie -- but you can learn and model much more than technology
20:51:38 Samantha Camisi -> Good Night everyone! I enjoyed my first EdTech & Interview. I have to get to work and have classes that start tomorrow night. Take care, -SC
20:51:39 cyndidannerkuhn -> Me too, YouTube has changed my class too!!
20:51:44 courosa -> @durff :-)
20:51:51 nancykeane -> I use youtube a lot!
20:51:53 kitchenerd -> they want to teach the way they learned
20:52:00 courosa -> me too, YT an incredible resource
20:52:12 BigMouthDurff -> youtube has an ed section
20:52:13 cyndidannerkuhn -> I am teaching a YouTube class during Inner-session in Jan. Gonna be exciting and fun!
20:52:18 BigMouthDurff -> why not use games
20:52:25 charlie -> @ Jen i agree.... but those who ignore the technology advances of the last 15 years ....?
20:52:27 BigMouthDurff -> or a virtual world?
20:52:32 plnaugle -> I have to convert YouTubes so I can show them in class.
20:52:34 matt montagne -> maybe Einstein had it right after all about TV :-)
20:52:35 ChrisJohnston -> There are also some good ed videos in google video
20:52:37 monika -> dan meyer's use of pictures
20:52:41 kitchenerd -> using second life as a means to deliver content
20:52:43 demacisaac -> how many classrooms have video's (you tube and more) blocked
20:52:51 JenW -> @charlie -- I don't think they ignore them ..... I just don't believe they are always necessary -- 100% in every class
20:52:57 kitchenerd -> many district filters block youtube
20:53:02 ChrisJohnston -> @plnaugle convert them to what?
20:53:02 BigMouthDurff -> so meet the challenge
20:53:17 kitchenerd -> editors make mistakes all the time!
20:53:22 plnaugle -> I convert them using Zamzar to WMV.
20:53:22 JenW -> or even 25%
20:53:23 courosa -> or, who are these scary non-registered students in my class that are here learning without credit?
20:53:23 matt montagne -> YouTube is a treasure trove of primary source documents...I don't know how it can be blocked in schools anymore
20:53:26 DaveChamberlain -> Bonk, C. J. (2008, March). YouTube anchors and enders: The use of shared online video content as a macrocontext for learning. Paper presented at the American Educational Research Association (AERA) 2008 Annual Meeting, New York, NY. [8:53:10 PM] Curt Bonk: http://www.publicationshare.com/SFX7EED.pdf
20:53:38 courosa -> Hey George!
20:53:39 charlie -> @ Jen W. i'd say more like 50%
20:53:44 BigMouthDurff -> courosa you're the communisy
20:53:46 BigMouthDurff -> not us
20:53:48 nancykeane -> @plnaugle Have you used kickyoutube?
20:54:01 George Veletsianos -> Hey Alec :)
20:54:03 cyndidannerkuhn -> whoo hoo thanks for the YouTube article!! thanks you so much
20:54:03 kitchenerd -> thanks davechamberlain!
20:54:08 JenW -> @courosa -- one mug will be sufficient....I don't wish to be greedy
20:54:21 plnaugle -> @nancykeane No I haven't what does it do?
20:54:26 ChrisJohnston -> Many schools pay a subscription service for filtering and YouTube is on the list
20:54:39 BigMouthDurff -> mug? i want a free coffee mug
20:54:56 cyndidannerkuhn -> what with the mugs?
20:55:01 courosa -> I'll bring a bunch to Educon
20:55:02 plnaugle -> @Durff I think you just want free coffee.
20:55:03 plind -> some are just worried about how much bandwidth having youtube available will eat up
20:55:10 BigMouthDurff -> @Chris and how do you think kids go around filters?
20:55:24 JenW -> @alec -- I am bringing a black marker. I want mine autographed
20:55:32 ChrisJohnston -> If you have bandwidth constraints YouTube will be a problem
20:55:34 BigMouthDurff -> coffee? did someone say coffee?
20:55:48 sendkathy -> yes Jeff
20:55:52 nancykeane -> @plnaugle When you find a youtube you want to download, simpy replace the "www." with "kick" and you can download as a mp4 (eg kickyoutube.)
20:56:01 matt montagne -> Chris Anderson's Free was a great model of the freemium economy
20:56:19 cyndidannerkuhn -> that kick tip works!!
20:56:26 jackiegerstein -> Yes Matt - I agree - Free was free
20:56:32 BigMouthDurff -> Courosa mug giveaway at Educon - attend the conference and get a free autographed mug = advertise freely
20:56:38 plnaugle -> @nancykeane TY for that info I'll check it out.
20:56:42 PeggyG -> you can also use download helper addon for Firefox and download any youtube video or other video
20:56:51 ChrisJohnston -> Ironic the supposedly 'tech savvy' Obama administration didn't think about the bandwidth issues that having his speech just be online would cause
20:56:55 cbeard -> @Peggy, what is the addon?
20:57:03 ChrisJohnston -> sorry that was grammatically awful
20:57:07 JenW -> @alec -- shoot, I should not have mentioned autographed. I wanted that just for me
20:57:16 matt montagne -> the open economy doesn't mean people don't make money...there are all sorts of ways to make money off of "free"
20:57:20 PeggyG -> it's actually called download helper
20:57:27 cyndidannerkuhn -> that sounds like a great idea Curtis
20:57:27 sendkathy -> @Curt - do you have a definition for teacher?
20:57:31 cbeard -> @Peggy, thanks.
20:57:38 cyndidannerkuhn -> books of stories would ne inspirational for sure
20:57:55 ChrisJohnston -> One of my online classes is using Chris Anderson's [i]Free[/i] next month
20:57:55 ransomtech -> Anyone have a free/open new 17" MBP for me? Thanks.
20:57:57 BigMouthDurff -> Twitter it now = Courosa mug giveaway at Educon - attend the conference and get a free autographed mug = advertise freely
20:58:01 plnaugle -> @Peggy TY for that info.
20:58:01 courosa -> see Alan Levine's Amazing Stories of Openness
20:58:25 courosa -> @durff :-)
20:58:26 BigMouthDurff -> someone tell chrislehmann
20:58:42 JenW -> @courosa -- ask Durff to fund this new giveaway
20:58:44 matt montagne -> some folks in this chat room have probably made a little $$ off of "free"
20:58:47 PeggyG -> I love download helper because it automatically activates if there is a video on the web page. It's great!
20:58:56 sendkathy -> Does open mean honest?
20:59:00 JenW -> @matt -- Free is never free anymore
20:59:06 plnaugle -> @Chris I downloaded Free but haven't read it yet.
20:59:13 monika -> open keeps us honest
20:59:19 monika -> i'm thinking
20:59:31 sendkathy -> maybe or perpetuates a lie at times just by word of mouth
20:59:31 JenW -> Open keeps us OPEN to new ideas
20:59:50 sendkathy -> people tend to repeat what they hear without checking it out
20:59:52 cyndidannerkuhn -> Interesting idea for collectiing
20:59:55 monika -> i think there's too many eyes for much damage to be done
20:59:58 ChrisJohnston -> I wanted the free audiobook of Free but I can't find it
21:00:04 monika -> true
21:00:22 matt montagne -> @Chris...Andrerson's free audio book/kindle version was offered for limited time only
21:00:24 BigMouthDurff -> open minds = dangerous thoughts = disrupting classrooms
21:00:30 matt montagne -> You can get "Free" as a PDF though
21:00:31 BigMouthDurff -> and that is me
21:00:37 plnaugle -> @chrisjohnson I'll see if I can find the ling.
21:00:40 JenM -> Writing Tips: http://travelinedman.blogspot.com/2007/01/quick-20-academic-writing-tips...
21:00:55 JenW -> @monika -- it is very hard to be transparent for some of us. (I will admit for me) -- but it is also very helpful at times, and has helped me fine tune ideas
21:00:57 courosa -> I'm with Curt on that one.
21:01:11 monika -> @jenw i agree
21:01:12 demacisaac -> your writing style is very compelling. Great choice
21:01:52 sendkathy -> I look forward to reading the book
21:01:55 JenW -> @monika -- but often, I wonder if it is worth the "hurt" to be transparent becuase I can be thin skinned sometimes. ;)
21:01:57 JL -> http://php.indiana.edu/~cjbonk/Syllabus_R685_Fall_of_2009.htm
21:02:08 cyndidannerkuhn -> I look forward to reading and exploring Curtis's stuff
21:02:10 DaveChamberlain -> http://php.indiana.edu/~cjbonk/Syllabus_R685_Fall_of_2009.htm
21:02:16 monika -> it's worth the hurt to teach kids how to do it right
21:02:20 monika -> i think
21:02:27 BigMouthDurff -> as opposed to cold links
21:02:28 JenW -> I would encourage you to broaden your focus to more projects and more people in the next book
21:02:56 BigMouthDurff -> clap clap clap clap clap clap clap
21:03:04 nancykeane -> LOVE the book!
21:03:04 sendkathy -> Thank you!
21:03:05 cyndidannerkuhn -> wow thanks, enjoyed this, from Kansas State University
21:03:07 demacisaac -> :D :D :D :D :)
21:03:10 matt montagne -> is an iPhone App on the horizon???
21:03:20 pshaf -> thank you
21:03:24 plnaugle -> @chris THe free thing is over.
21:03:28 Audrey -> :D Thank you!
21:03:30 courosa -> you bet Curt ... take care.
21:03:31 ransomtech -> Thanks!
21:03:32 PeggyG -> Jen M is famous-her story is in his section on ustreaming a ustream :-)
21:03:36 BigMouthDurff -> i gtg hold a cute kid = bye!!
21:03:41 matt montagne -> having an iPhone App to go along with a book seems to be a new hook
21:03:41 nancykeane -> Thank you!
21:03:42 plnaugle -> TY Curt very interesting session.
21:03:50 sendkathy -> bye durf
21:03:59 cbeard -> Sorry to have arrived so late. Good night, all.
21:04:13 kcaise -> don't forget to sign up for the webcastathon for this upcoming weekend! http://www.webcastacademy.net
21:04:13 ChrisJohnston -> @plnaugle I guess I'll have to be happy reading the book for class next month
21:04:19 monika -> :)
21:04:44 sendkathy -> night
21:04:47 jackiegerstein -> I saw her speak A NECC 09 - she is amazing
21:05:01 jackiegerstein -> A prodigy teacher at 11 yesr old
21:05:31 JenM -> @peggyg ... :)
21:05:48 PeggyG -> it couldn't go unmentioned Jen!
21:06:04 George Veletsianos -> that's great advice for us starting academics Curt ;)
21:06:18 cyndidannerkuhn -> I get that, it is hard to do everything and tenure get in the way, so glad to be done with tenure!!
21:06:31 JenM -> helps when your prof. is the writer of the book :)
21:07:22 courosa -> @george sounds like i need a career change. :-)
21:07:53 George Veletsianos -> @courosa we are in it for the long haul buddy :)
21:08:18 cyndidannerkuhn -> have a great week, thanks for the learning tonight
21:08:22 PeggyG -> awesome conversation!!! very stimulating and inspiring! Thanks Curt and ETW!
21:08:27 matt montagne -> applies to schools as well, no?? Shouldn't we encourage young learners to follow their passions at an early age so it doesn't take them as long to figure this out as it did curt??
21:08:33 jackiegerstein -> Great 2 hours - way fun!
21:08:38 matt montagne -> Cheers!
21:08:40 ransomtech -> Go write that grant!
21:08:51 matt montagne -> Thanks, Curt! On Wisconsin and Go Badgers!
21:09:19 matt montagne -> nice job moderating ETT crew!
21:09:41 George Veletsianos -> thanks 4 hosting this. It's 2 am in Manchester, so i need to zzz. thnx!
21:09:47 PeggyG -> laughing hysterically!
21:09:52 cyndidannerkuhn -> You guys are great, thanks for your hard work!!
21:09:54 plnaugle -> Good night all. Thank you for hosting this.
21:10:00 JenM -> @matt ... I was at the game this Saturday ... "Varsity ... Varsity ... U-ra-ra- wis-con-sin ..."
21:10:26 DaveChamberlain -> Wow, look at everyone running out of the room :-)
21:10:39 JenM -> everyone is hungry :)
21:10:57 DaveChamberlain -> true, I think my wife ate while I was online.
21:11:06 JenM -> nite all!
21:11:18 DaveChamberlain -> nite everyone (who's left)
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